What will I lose
Platinum
Reged: 05/21/07
Posts: 764
Loc: PA
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She now says she will fight for things that were here when she moved in. ie i had a lot of furniture etc. She says when she married me it became marital assets. Also she said she will be fighting for stuff my grandmother gave me...which to me shows pure lack of class. Here i thought the house stuff would be easier but it's not obviously.
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call me WWIL...PA resident 39 year old , married 11 years, together 12...splitting in 13th year.
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allthumbs
Platinum
Reged: 07/12/07
Posts: 574
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Property you owned separately prior to marriage and any inheritance of family heirlooms belong to you. And the same applies to her. Anything she brought into the marriage belongs to her. Property acquired prior to marriage is the property of the individual plus gifts and inheritances are also considered personal property.
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What will I lose
Platinum
Reged: 05/21/07
Posts: 764
Loc: PA
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thanks, thats what i thought, plus its RUDE to think she can even count my grandmothers stuff as marital assets. Geez it's not that much even. few pieces of furniture.
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call me WWIL...PA resident 39 year old , married 11 years, together 12...splitting in 13th year.
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gigi
Platinum
Reged: 11/06/06
Posts: 5178
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Your stbx has lost her mind. But we already knew that, didn't we? Don't buy into her stuff, try instituting a no contact rule (I know the situation, I know it's tough, but make the woman MOVE) and struggle through.
Make a list of everything (on a spreadsheet) in the house and in the very last column, where it came from, whether it was yours before marriage or hers or from your grandma or you bought it together on your honeymoon or was a wedding gift or whatever.
Oh phooey, let me to this right.
Column 1, rooms where you keep stuff (including garage, basement, attic, storage unit)
column 2, items in each room (including furniture, items on the furniture, and items in the closets, on walls, and sitting on the floor. Also if there are boxes or containers of stuff, items in the contriners (jewelry boxes, list the box, and each item in it).
column 3 HERS SEPARATE
Column 4 HIS SEPARATE
Column 5 JOINTLY OWNED
column 6 values of jointly owned items
column 7 GOES TO HER
column 8 VALUE of what is in column 7
column 9 GOES TO HIM
COlumn 10 VALUE of what is in column 9
column 11 explanation
You'll want to make totals of the numbers listed in columns 6, 8 & 10.
OK, you can see columns 3, 4, 5, 7 & 9 only require checkmarks. Anything that ends up separate does not require a value listed. And once you get the totals of columns 8 & 10 (just use the total of column 6 to make certain 8 & 10 add up properly), then you'll know how much "equalizing payment" one of you has to pay to the other in order to keep what's in your column.
You make a list with column a & B filled out. She looks at it and adds stuff if she thinks you've been incomplete. This gives you one small successful negotiation of WHAT is in hte house. Next step is to write down where everything came from (that last column). You write down what you remember about it, she writes down what she remembers, and where you are the same, keep it, where you are different... oh heck, you can divide it into two different columns if you want to keep your explanations separate.
IF it was a gift from one to the other or from anyone outside the two of you to EITHER of you, that gift stays with teh person it was given to. If it was an inheritance, it stays with the person who inherited it. If it was owned before the marriage, it stayed with teh person who owned it.
NOW you should have columns 1, 2, 3, 4, 5 and 11 (maybe also 12) filled out with names and Xs & all kinds of other stuff. and you may agree on it all or you may disagree. just TRY to come up with values for column 6.
You can choose fair market value, garage sale value, e-bay value... heck, you can CHOOSE to use the value you paid for stuff without depreciating it or WITH depreciation, but whatever value you use, try to use it for EVERY item.
THEN, take those items out of the list, make a fresh list with just those items.
You have a few choices from now. You can take turns choosing an item. You can agree on stuff (he gets the living room & dining room, she gets basement & breakfast room furniture, etc., etc). You can have one of you split the list into what they think are two fair (equal value) lists and have the OTHER choose which of the two lists to take.
The third way is easiest and makes it so that you can skip assigning a value in column 6. But some people freak out at the possibility of splitting a china set and if the other person has proposed that, well, if you choose it, you take it.
NOW, if you choose the A-B list method (the last choice), you CAN, after choosing, ask each other to trade off items that are particularly of interest to either of you.
This is TEDIOUS and annoying, and if you get your lawyers involved in it, it will be WAY more expensive than the value of the stupid stuff.
So ...
I know she doesnt want to think of it, but just you start... put all hte stuff down on paper and let her look at it and add stuff... then take the next step. one step at a time and you might be able to get it all done and just leave ... well, like youre grandma's things... to argue over.
Frankly, if you plan the split of stuff and then move her share out to a storage place or to her parents', maybe she'll find it easier to get herself out.
If you can get the OTHER stuff resolved and leave just the personal stuff, and she takes to her lawyer a claim that she wants something she agrees that your grandma gave ot you or that she agrees was already in your house when she married you... well... her lawyer will probably school her on the fact that its not hers and she's going to have to move past that, and if he/she does NOT educate your ex in this, well, I'd be surprised... your fight in court on that stuff will be pretty easy if THAT is all that's left.
So try to split up the jointly owned stuff evenly and get that part over with, save the rest for later.
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jbar
Platinum
Reged: 12/16/06
Posts: 1076
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Gigi, you are nuts!
How can you waste almost 4000 words on relatively trivial nonsense, like how to divide up a few old sticks of furniture, when men are daily being robbed of their life's savings by stupid law which insistently assumes that their wives somehow were responsible for the creation of at least half of it, even when they DEMONSTRABLY had nothing to do with creating even one cent of it? These same preposterous laws then proceed to self-rightiously award the woman, in addition to the man's life savings--his house, the kids and perhaps lifetime alimony--for no other reason but that she has decided she now prefers his assets to him.
Do you really believe that belaboring the question of division of relatively worthless trash, as you have done, is really more important than exposing the massive fraud I have described? Could there be anything more valuable and worthwhile than to contine to bring this out and to keep it on the minds of members here? Are you attempting to create a one-woman smoke screen to divert the attention of people from these overwhelmingly important issues involving the fraudulent nature of modern divorce law, to serve your own agenda, and that of feminists?
Edited by jbar (02/13/08 12:27 AM)
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gigi
Platinum
Reged: 11/06/06
Posts: 5178
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WWIL was asking whether she would get his grandmother's stuff and the furniture that was his when he first married her as well as half the rest. I answered.
You blather on about rhetoric while not doing a thing to help your own cause or move forward in your own life. You damage your cause every time you open your mouth.
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jbar
Platinum
Reged: 12/16/06
Posts: 1076
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===========================================================
WWIL was asking whether she would get his grandmother's stuff and the furniture that was his when he first married her as well as half the rest. I answered.
You blather on about rhetoric while not doing a thing to help your own cause or move forward in your own life. You damage your cause every time you open your mouth.
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I now have the answer to my question , "Are you attempting to create a one-woman smoke screen to divert the attention of people from these overwhelmingly important issues involving the fraudulent nature of modern divorce law, to serve your own agenda, and that of feminists?"
The answer is yes.
Before you can wake people up, get them unbrainwashed and aware of reality, you first have to communicate to them. Unfortunately this is the first step in "advancing the cause" of any kind of reform in a demobcracy. I choose to "light a candle" in this sense, in however minimally effective way my comments here may be, rather than to "curse the darkness".
Since the thoughts of most men are controlled by their wives, this as a formidable task, but I derive great pleasure and satisfaction in trying anyway. If it irritates you, then I am doubly pleased.
Edited by jbar (02/13/08 12:49 AM)
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mrpat
Platinum
Reged: 09/12/07
Posts: 2763
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Damn Jbar your a dick. The man asked a question and she answered. Is everything out of your mouth about bashing women. Chicken sh!t.
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jbar
Platinum
Reged: 12/16/06
Posts: 1076
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===========================================================
Damn Jbar your a dick. The man asked a question and she answered. Is everything out of your mouth about bashing women. Chicken sh!t.
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This isn't about bashing women, it is about people (like you) who can't hear--or say--anything not to their own advantage and that of their particular interest-group. These same women, like gigi, like to drown out the offending comments with interesting-sounding but totally insignificant and meaningless voluminous nonsense, instead of acknowledging the legitimacy of said comments and addressing the dilemmas and injustice which they so clearly expose.
I have found the solution to law, like the one I referenced in my foregoing post here, which requires that women be allowed to have their cake (from men) and eat it too. The size of the cakes will be reduced by half!
Edited by jbar (02/13/08 08:35 PM)
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KGrow
Platinum
Reged: 01/27/06
Posts: 3153
Loc: Colorado
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"She now says she will fight for things that were here when she moved in. ie i had a lot of furniture etc. She says when she married me it became marital assets."
She's not right but that's almost irrelevant. She's clearly looking for a fight. Keep this in mind when you decide how to respond. Personal property is often an issue in divorce loaded with emotion and contention disproportionate to its actual value.
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