KU girl
New
Reged: 05/28/08
Posts: 10
Loc: Denver
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We are going to be creating ours and I just don't want to leave any stone unturned. I realize each situationn is different, but wanted to see if you unfortunately left anything out or included anything I might be missing.
I'm referring to things like:
No out of country trips without prior approval from other parent
No overnight guests while son is with parent, until engagement or marriage
etc
Thanks in advance!
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lexigirl
New
Reged: 05/28/08
Posts: 6
Loc: California
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There are a couple books at the library that are all about parenting plans & agreements - not sure of the names but I looked at them when I was trying to write up a settlement. ( I'm still not divorced) My stbx went on a trip with his girlfriend while he was still living in our house, her husband died and they got money from a preschool garage sale to help her with finances and they all went to an amusement water park a couple of hours away and stayed in the same condo - my stbx and daughter on the pull out couch - her sons and her on the bed in the bedroom - with the door open so they could all see each other. The kids were 4,4, and 7 and my lawyer said I could not do anything about it. The stbx did not even give me an address in an emergency - only a cell phone number. So I am not sure about putting no sleepovers until engagement, marriage - some states don't care about that . I guess CA is one of them. I think in some states like NC, that would be a big deal.
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KU girl
New
Reged: 05/28/08
Posts: 10
Loc: Denver
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Thanks. I'll check and see what Colorado's laws on that are.
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faith4two
Platinum
Reged: 11/11/07
Posts: 353
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So that you're not creating any ill-will, I'd include days which you don't typically find on a state standard visitation order, such as: kid(s) are with you on your b'day and the STBX's on what I assume to be "his" b'day, alternating Valentine's, and alternating the child's birthday.
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gigi
Platinum
Reged: 11/06/06
Posts: 5141
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Realize that "no overnight guests" is VERY un-specific and could include not lettin gyour son have overnight visitors, not letting grandparents come stay, etc. It would also prevent you from taking vacations with a romantic interest and hsi family and your son.
Right of first refusal for babysitting is a good one. CHild stays in current school as long as one parent remains within the school district unless both parents agree to switch the school... and if the parents both move out of the district and can't agree on a new school district, it will be whichever is rated better.
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juliacinaz
Platinum
Reged: 02/03/08
Posts: 911
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I regret the during the week school nights visitation. Our daughter is too tired and then sleeps on my evenings. I do all the work...get her to bed and up for school etc while he plays santa dad. I wish I would have let him have her for 1 whole week so he could pay for lunches and get her to school and have some of the difficult parts. Instead I have most of the hard stuff and she just plays with him and eats fast food. I on the other hand make sure the homework is done and wash all the clothes etc. My ex has a brain injury and I do not trust him to have her for extended periods of time. He refuses to clothe her also so I have that expense but at least I know she is covered. He sent her to school once in a skirt with no panties on! WTF?
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Sarah1014
Platinum
Reged: 04/12/07
Posts: 2348
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I don't know if this really falls under the parenting plan but it's good stuff.
We didn't indicate that oral surgery was part of orthodontia. Now I'm possibly into it for half the oral surgery. Oral surgery may actually be medical, BUT--you wouldn't have this particular surgery done in an absence of braces!
Also: If there are college savings, indicate the current balance.
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leesie
Bronze
Reged: 05/28/08
Posts: 28
Loc: Wisconsin
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I would put in a stipulation about what to do if both parents do not agree.
Pick out a consuler or a mediator who you could give tie breaking authority to. I mean, how awful would it be if you wanted one thing, he another, and there was no way to decide who would win?
Thats the biggest thing I regret.
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I can't live within you-- David Bowie
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KU girl
New
Reged: 05/28/08
Posts: 10
Loc: Denver
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Thanks everyone!
I never thought about orthodontia/oral surgery, etc.
And I will make sure to define what I mean by overnight guest (any stupid skank [censored] who is there for the sole purpose of boinking my STBX.) I kid, I kid.
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Jada
Platinum
Reged: 06/02/07
Posts: 3463
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[quote]Thanks everyone!
I never thought about orthodontia/oral surgery, etc.
And I will make sure to define what I mean by overnight guest (any stupid skank [censored] who is there for the sole purpose of boinking my STBX.) I kid, I kid. [/quote]
Don't be surprised if you don't get that. Unless you live in the bible belt or he agrees to it, you aren't going to be able to impose your morality onto him.
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KGrow
Platinum
Reged: 01/27/06
Posts: 3153
Loc: Colorado
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I regret that we did not work out a clear agreement on how extracurriculars were paid. We spent a lot of time on it during the divorce and couldn't agree so had to give up and put somewhat nebulous language in the parenting plan. We now have something to fight about every 6 months or so. It gives us something to do, I guess.
The no overnights with romantic friends thing is not particularly enforcible. It will just give you something to fight about.
The purpose of putting in requirement for approval of international travel is fear he'll run off with the kids to a country with no treaty with the US on custody issues. If this is not a concern then you can leave it as a requirement to convey itinerary and contact information prior to any travel.
First right of refusal is good but be sure to specify a reasonable time frame. Mine applies only to overnights and that has worked out well. If the time frame is too short, it is disenfranchising and a pain in the ass.
Spell out dates and times for all holiday time. Spell out transportation and who picks up and who drops off. On exchanges, it is generally better for the kids to be dropped off than picked up as it minimizes uncomfortable wait time and opportunity to argue in front of the kids. If possible, incorporate exchanges into the school schedule as in, you bring them to school in the morning and he picks them up in the afternoon after school.
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KU girl
New
Reged: 05/28/08
Posts: 10
Loc: Denver
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[quote
Don't be surprised if you don't get that. Unless you live in the bible belt or he agrees to it, you aren't going to be able to impose your morality onto him. [/quote]
Are you normally this welcoming to new members?
As my profile shows, I'm not in the bible belt. I think my STBX would agree with the no overnight guests policy wholeheartedly. I just wanted it in writing for emphasis. I'll be sure to discuss with attorney. Thanks for your advice.
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KGrow
Platinum
Reged: 01/27/06
Posts: 3153
Loc: Colorado
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Forgot to mention another successful item in our parenting plan was requirement to work out child-related issues through a mediation/arbitration process. It will save you time and money and generally does a better job of furthering the best interests of the children than court visits. Make sure to choose your mediator/arbitrator carefully.
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dlktx
New
Reged: 01/18/06
Posts: 13
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I would definitely try to work it out so that your ex has some of the "harder" parenting times. My son was 6 when we divorce and I didn't trust him ex to be able to provide for my son because I was the stay at home mom and worked. Depending on the current age of your children you may want to try to include a progress to the possession time based on his ability to provide for the child. You may not believe it, but ex's do inventually learned to clothe, bath, feed, and be responsible. I am paying for my fears today. My son is approaching 16 and he's getting into trouble. My ex won't take him into this home to change schools and get him out of a potentional bad situation.
good luck.
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ttina
Platinum
Reged: 02/28/08
Posts: 398
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Look at things 5/10/15 years down the road.... will child go to afterschool... summer camp... t-ball??? Will child be able to be in band, field trips, scouts? Will child have a car, insurance, afterschool job?
Now that you have a picture in your head... who will pay for these items? What if child has a scout meeting during mom/dad time and that parent refuses to take child or let you p/u child for events? Are you going to split costs of extracurriculars... if so who makes the call on when there are too many expensive activities?
Then look into the future of your life... What if you get this amazing chance at a job in Hawaii??? Where will child go or will child stay? What if your STBX gets the same offer... Remember both sides of the relocation blade can cut, you need to be able to deal with speed bumps in the road. Think ahead and remain openminded with the child(ren) behing the focus.
Good Luck
PS what about dicipline? not just spanking, but will punishments be honored in both homes? This is something you need to have in place by grade school. Who is responsible for taking off when child is sick from school.
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cedc
Platinum
Reged: 03/02/07
Posts: 560
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Any regrets about parenting plans isn't usually about what you put in, but FORGOT to put in and wish you did.
It has nothing to do with being welcoming to new members, thats the reality of it. Overnight guest stipulations will be granted under temporary orders until finalized. If both parties agree any way after the divorce and somebody breaks that stipulation it will not be upheld in court. People move on(and have a right to do so)and its alittle unrealistic to enforce. Taking that issue to court is only going to burn money. I'm welcoming you aboard, but that little nugget aint gonna fly later on down the road.
Your focus on any good parenting plan should be cut and dry,EVERYTHING that could be a potential sticking point should be defined. Any vague points are open to interpretation and usually leads to conflict.
Who has and what kind of custody?
A defined parenting/holiday/vacation schedule
Medical- Who and How its paid
College
Grandparents
Right of First Refusal
Medical Decisions
School
Where the kids will live
Can the custodial parent move? Yes/No How far?
If yes,who pays for the make up time to the other parent
Phone contact
Mediation before litigation AND who pays for it
Plus a whole lot more. My parenting plan is extreme, because my X tried to steal my kids. Hopefully your situation is better than mine, but the overnight guest thingy should be dropped. Focus about anything and everything else that could cause conflict and put it in there.
Our holiday schedule is clearly spelled out. Christmas morning was with me this year and we still fought about it. She wanted it and I said no. Good Times!
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My X makes Peg Bundy look good.
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KU girl
New
Reged: 05/28/08
Posts: 10
Loc: Denver
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Thanks for the detailed replies. I'm incredibly grateful.
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utdivorce
Gold
Reged: 02/26/07
Posts: 147
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Experience tells me that you will most likely leave a lot of things out. The important thing, in my opinion, is that both parents have equal time w/the children. "Sole" custody in my opinion is bull$hit. If both parents have equal access to the children it will most likely work out in the long run. But if someone decides to play the smarty game and want Child $upport, tax benefits, alimony, food stamps and the freebies, that's when the problems start. What I learned is that the courts don't give a fcuk about what's in the "best interest of the children." Good luck
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mistake#2
Platinum
Reged: 07/19/06
Posts: 3257
Loc: Florida
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[quote]If both parents have equal access to the children it will most likely work out in the long run.
**Not necessarily...some parents say they want equal time but then don't take it or skip visits because either it's not convenient or they have personal plans.
(quote) But if someone decides to play the smarty game and want Child $upport, tax benefits, alimony, food stamps and the freebies, that's when the problems start. What I learned is that the courts don't give a fcuk about what's in the "best interest of the children." Good luck [/quote]
**I agree that the courts often don't interfere in the best interests of the child...however I disagree that expecting a non-custodial parent to pay child support is somehow "smarty game" or asking for a freebie. I wouldn't expect to put my child into daycare but then not be held accountable for payment, I wouldn't expect a neighbor or someone to feed & clothe my child without compensation, and I wouldn't expect someone else to raise my child 75% of the time without equal compensation.
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mistake#2
Platinum
Reged: 07/19/06
Posts: 3257
Loc: Florida
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KU, I wouldn't say that I regret anything in the parenting plan...but I do find a lot of things are very hard to enforce. Can't enforce that ex doesn't drink or do drugs while taking his medication, shut I can't even enforce the order that he continue to take his meds and continue counseling. Putting in the order things like him putting my proper name on his cell phone while he has the children (instead of dirty f@cking c@nt), even taking child to daycare has been pretty fruitless...and its stupid to have to put that he refrain from verbally or physically abusing the children, yet its in there to no avail.
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saamrodi
Platinum
Reged: 06/14/07
Posts: 2902
Loc: here
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I should have requested that the ex take some classes and then be monitored or observed with the kids before allowing him to have them on his own. Its something I felt always needed anyways but I dont know. Maybe I was just soo burned out when the time finally came that I just wanted it over with and it didnt get put in.
If you truely feel the ex needs supplemental classes or something along that lines where it concerns the kids...get it in the decree. Its a waste of time to try and get it afterwards.
Also, I thought about the overnights thing but its soo well known that its not really enforceable anyways. It would have made my ex more determined to break it had I put it in there.
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hispoohbear
Bronze
Reged: 05/21/07
Posts: 47
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The thing that sticks most in my mind right now is birthdays.
1. Parents birthdays-do they go to the parent on that parents birthday? For how long? Over night? What happens if the birthday is on a weekday or weekend?
2. Child's birthday-Who holds the party? What about the actual day? My advice-do not commit to a joint birthday party. When my husband and his ex filled out the new parenting plan, it seemed okay at the time. Fast forward 10 months to the actual birthday and we are fighting with her. I don't want her in my house, so now we have to have it somewhere (more expensive). Next year, (still not getting along albeit for a different reason) she wants to have it at her house. I don't want to be in her house, so we try to arrange it so we would not go to stepdaughters big party, but have a small family dinner at home on our next weekend. Ex did not want to give up being able to horn into our party plans the next year, so she had it at a park. Then we had to go and stand around with her and her friends. Plus you don't want the kids to end up with 2 big parties and the parents trying to out do each other every year.
3. Other family member birthdays-grandparents? other siblings?
Just remember that every thing you want for yourself, the other parent will get too. Someone once said on here, to reverse what you are asking for (he gets what you want for you and you get what you want to give him), and see if you would sign on the dotted line. I thought that was excellent advice that in most cases (no abuse, drug use, etc.) would benefit the children greatly. Good luck!!
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numbnms
Platinum
Reged: 10/18/07
Posts: 708
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I have no overnight stays by members of the opposit sex that are not related by blood or marriage when the childrn are present in my decree. So it can and is done, if more people stood up for their morals and held people actually accountable for their actions maybe there wouldnt be half the divorces going on.
The question would you sign this agreement if the roles were reversed is a very good one to ask yourself.
Have you thought about what kind of custody plans you would like to have in place? Think outside the box, every other weekend is not a parent its a big brother or sister. It will also alienate the ncp from the children, this is another problem in most cases. If you expect your stbx to be supportive of the children then they have to be significant in their lives; this is not done every other weekend. Our plan is week on week off, some have balked at such an idea but has been working for the past 10 months so until something breaks I aint fixing it.
College expenses?
Who will carry the children on their insurance?
Who will claim the kids on taxes?
Who will pay out of pocket medical and dental expenses?
Who will pay for school supplies and what does that cover?
Who will pay for activties outside of school and who gets to decide what they can and can't do?
Highly suggest every other year on the kids birthdays (see the above poster for why), in the event you are getting along fine with the ex you can always attend the parties otherwise its best to spell it out.
Mediate before litigate is pretty standard now and is infinately better for the children benifit being considered.
Just some ideas, there is nothing to far out there as long as you both agree.
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Forget waiting for the storm to pass
Learn to dance in the rain
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